--- Forwarded Message from "Dennis D. Magnuson" <[log in to unmask]> --- >In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]> >References: <[log in to unmask]> >Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 18:56:22 -0600 >To: Language Learning and Technology International Information Forum <[log in to unmask]> >From: "Dennis D. Magnuson" <[log in to unmask]> >Subject: Re: #7807 placement test Placing incoming students LLTI Colleagues and others interested in Language Placement, Like many other institutions, Luther College for many years faced this problem of false beginners--we used to call them "sand-baggers--who filled up our lower level courses, especially the beginning level. The problem, as we ultimately discovered, was that we merely stated that a student had to take ANY number of credits in a second language, regardless of where they started. As a result, we too had "non-language types" just taking the 101/102 steps (maybe adding 201 or 202). The consequences were that we would have, say for Spanish, 7 sections of 101, 4-5 of 102, and 2 or 3 of Sp 201. Several years ago we made some curricular changes and got faculty support for a minimum second language requirement that stated the 3 semester course was needed for anyone who had studied at least one year of that same language in high school. In effect, it provided an incentive for those students to complete their requirement with only one course--but at the third semester level. BTW, for those who wish to take a new language, i.e., not continue with one that they had studied in high school, the requirement is still 101 and 102. That allows for students to try languages that they might not have had in high school (think Norwegian at Luther College!, though it could be Italian, Russian, Hebrew, or a couple of others). The result: we now have more or less flip-flopped our enrolments. This past fall we had 3 sections of 101, 4 of 102, and 6 of 201 (we have had as high as 7 of 201). Although we have not totally deterred the false beginners, we feel that we have made great strides toward a more normal pattern based on entering high school backgrounds. I have often thought that we might even add another item and state that only those taking 201 or 202 would be considered for graduation or departmental honors, though the politics in that kind of thinking are not for the faint of heart. In any event, to just state A MINIMUM will get just that. Set the bar "a bit" higher, and it just may give the kind of results that we have experienced. For those with a full two year language requirement (or higher), I presume they may have even fewer problems than we used to. I look forward to reading how others have dealt with this problem of the false beginner. Dennis D. Magnuson Assoc. Prof. of Spanish Luther College Decorah, IA 52101 (319) 387-2160 [log in to unmask] Responding to Placement Test Query: > >Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2005 16:00:26 -0500 >>To: [log in to unmask] >>From: Hiroyo Saito <[log in to unmask]> > >Subject: placement test >Haverford, PA 19041 [v011] >Hello, > >The Spanish department asked me to post this message. > >"The department of Spanish is contemplating the possibility of >changing our placement procedure for next year. We would like to know >if other language departments at other institutions have specific >policies related to the selection of students at the beginning level. >Do, for instance, some of these universities require a minimum score >at the placement test for students who have already been exposed to >the language at the high school level?" > >The Spanish department has been placing students who have taken >Spanish in high school but who do not get a minimum score for the >intermediate class in the placement test into the beginner's level >along with students who have never taken Spanish before. >The number of students in the beginner's level has been increasing >and they do not have enough staff members to create a new class for >false beginners. They do not want to set a minimum score for the >beginner's level because they do not want to close to the door to the >students who have never taken Spanish before. They would like to >accept the true beginners, but they would like to limit the number of >false beginners somehow. They are seeking ideas which allow them to >do this. >If you have any experience in similar situations, please let me know. >I would appreciate your inputs. >Thank you. >Hiroyo > >-- >*********************************** >Hiroyo Saito >Director of Language Learning Center >Haverford College >370 Lancaster Avenue >Haverford, PA 19041 >(610)896-4971 >[log in to unmask] >http://www.haverford.edu/llc >************************************ *********************************************** LLTI is a service of IALLT, the International Association for Language Learning, and The Consortium for Language Teaching and Learning (http://consortium.dartmouth.edu). Join IALLT at http://iallt.org. Otmar Foelsche, LLTI-Editor ([log in to unmask]) ***********************************************